More duff stuff

[Skywave]

I replaced the flimsy plastic door handle on our Fridge/Freezer with a hand-carved Ali. one - worked a treat.
Alan

I'm glad you mentioned that, since for a long time I have become increasingly irritated by manufacturers who use plastic for certain structural assemblies and parts where plastic is clearly unsuitable for the stresses and strains that that part or assembly will have to endure. In many cases, (but not all), for its intended use, that part would have been far more suitable for its intended task if it had been manufactured from metal - aluminium often (but not always) being a suitable alternative.

As for the argument that it makes sense (for the manufacturer) to make certain parts from plastic and other parts from metal - so that the life-span of each will be approximately equal - to me, that is a short-sighted view by the manufacturer. Suppose, for example, that an easily replaceable plastic handle snaps but, say, the motor is still functional. Assuming that a replacement handle is available (which it often isn't), I'm left with a defective appliance that will probably have to be scrapped for the sake of a cheap bit of plastic. However if the motor had failed, then since I know that that is a major and expensive part, although the item will still have to be scrapped, I won't feel so bad about it. Therefore the fitting of that plastic handle has left me feeling that the manufacturer cares not how I perceive the quality of his manufacturing (even if other parts, e.g. the motor) is of impeccable quality. Hence, when I do purchase a replacement item, I am immediately discouraged from buying from that manufacturer again. All very good - in theory. Trouble with that philosophy is, of course, that the proliferation of plastic is so manifest - and often in places that cannot be seen until dismantling has occurred - that there is, in reality, little choice available to avoid such built-in poor quality engineered products.
In summary, yes, plastic, as an engineering and manufacturing material, does indeed have its place in assemblies, but it tends to be mis-applied and over-used, to the detriment of the manufacturer and customer alike.

Al. / July16, 2013 //

[Skywave]

Does anyone else get the feeling that there's a lot of "Ain't it Awful" on this site?
Gary

On this particular site: no; in this particular thread: maybe - but the level of discontent expressed does not seem to be without some justification.

Al.

[Refugee]

I have never bought a new door catch for a washing machine.
It is a simple case of them being so flimsy even when new and they also get hot and go brown and brittle after a few weeks. A V5 microswitch and a little bit of chopping has never lead to a bounced job yet.

The best example of a branded product having a fault that was known to the manufacturer was a Molinex kettle.
It used to leak about half a teaspoon of water each night. How annoying.
Under the water level indicator there was a little hole molded into the plastic for the leaking water to escape onto the live base connections. It went bang in the middle of the night. I will only buy a kettle if there is one on display so that I can check for this built in fault before I buy it.

I had a Beko freezer and the motor stopped and it thawed out while the traffic light indicator showed green. It lied to me so now Beko is a banned brand name from my home. At least I court it before it set my home on fire thank goodness.

[AlanBeckett]

Here you go, a long-term solution to the 'Flimsy Handle' problem.
Guaranteed to outlast the Fridge, and probably you as well

Alan

   

[pwdrive]

I should say.

When we got this place there was an old LEC fridge in the old caravan which was disconnected, rust everywhere, it looked a real heap, we fired it up and it worked, we are still using it four years on, but will change for a swish job when I set upon the kitchen.

[Refugee]

I have got a new pair with a metal rivet and they even cut those thin plastic bags you get from the fresh vegetable section at the supermarket.

[Yorkie]

Don't be silly David, the plroliferation of Models is to stop you comparing prices properly and hence overcome any problems with RPM. You'll find lots of very similar Models all with slightly different Specs and all at different prices.

Alan

I can understand lots of models between competing manufacturers - just as with cars, but I didn't perhaps make it clear that I was referring to individual makes. EG, at the link I gave to the Bosch door interlock, it is used on 70 different Bosch/Siemens/Neff appliances. I'd consider seventy from the same maker a needless proliferation. It's not for example like re-styling a car.

Still, it's their business - not mine.

[Yorkie]

Bosch, Neff, Siemens - all the same outfit, and all have their weak point, notably those in regular use, such as flimsy plastic door handles on which thee fixing points held in place by self-tapping screws fracture, door hinges, catches, interlocks etc.

You just must be very unlucky or have people who use more than reasonable effort David.

Gary

I was referring mainly to my daughter in law's Bosch machine. There are five in their household so the washer is in regular use, but that's neither here nor there - the handle would stand up to that if it was more robust. I've replaced the handle a couple of times - the door catch is quite strong, so the handle has to be tugged to open it. The handle fits around the rim of the door from about the 10 o' clock position to about 2 o' clock is flimsy plastic held in place by three self tapping screws which screw into hollow pillars moulded into the handle. Quite simply, over time, those pillars snap off the handle moulding, and when one snaps, that puts pressure on the others, which then also snap due to the added stress.

All the washers spares outfits stock them, as not surprisingly, they're a high turnover item. If you saw the poor design of the handle, I think you'd agree that it does rather blow away the myth about German goods invariably being top quality and more solidly built. Often, it's a perception that doesn't stand close examination, but it's the perception that helps German products command a higher price. The price doesn't necessarily mean a better product - its the 'brand premium'.

I'm not, as you might imagine - whinging about this - the handles are cheap, as well they might be, and it's no big deal to remove the three screws from the remnants of the old handle. All things mechanical will break down, and I'm not of course suggesting that duff door handles mean that the whole machine is of poor quality, but the handle isn't simply a decorative trim - it's a functional part which is used every time the machine is used.

As to too much 'ain't it awful' on the forum, in a thread entitled 'more duff stuff' in the 'general chat' section, it's inevitable that posts will be about personal experiences with naff products, but as with all threads, posts aren't force fed - they're self selected, and just as it's ok for me to be writing this post as long as it's decent and honest, we're all endowed with free will, and everyone has an inalienable right to just ignore it as a load of hot air from a windbag who could bore for Europe. Anyone who has read this far has done so because they've chosen to - not because they're compelled to.

I dare say that there are many forum members who only ever read posts about vintage radio (it is after all, a vintage radio forum!) and never look into the lounge, general chat or whatever. In the same vein, I couldn't be less interested in TVs, audio, old phones, tape recorders, turntables, Dansettes, computers, battery portable radios, old clocks, toasters, vintage Christmas lights and lots of other stuff, so I routinely ignore such topics and leave them to those who are excited about them.

[Radio Fixer]

Well David this time you gave an example but before it seemed like a general whinge!

" I was referring mainly to my daughter in law's Bosch machine. There are five in their household so the washer is in regular use, but that's neither here nor there - the handle would stand up to that if it was more robust ... "

OK: fair point. I should have started a thread entitled "More great stuff"

"As to too much 'ain't it awful' on the forum, in a thread entitled 'more duff stuff' in the 'general chat' section, it's inevitable that posts will be about personal experiences with naff products"

So your daughter is doing more washing than my lady (is she the only one using the machine? or do the kids work it? Often a cause of excess failures) ... just had a look on the handle of ours: its an Advantix 7. looks perfectly strong enough to me. Has very limited travel and the actual catch part is metal. Not broken yet and looks like it will go on for a long time as she is very gentle. Put a tiny scratch on any of her appliances and I'm in deep trouble!

So you don't like Bosch: what do you recommend that's better? For me I will stick with them as had good life, few troubles and the price is about right. Could go for Miele but they are usually much more expensive and who's to say better.

Just had a look at two more machines in the Utility area (a rare area for me to take much interest in). There is a Whirlpool (Philips?) Fridge Freezer and a chest freezer. Both > 10 years old, no probs, no breaks, just keep on going.

Most amazing washer we had was a Zanusi that was 15 years old when it went due to leaks I couldn't be bothered to fix. In that time I bypassed the door interlock (don't need one), replaced the door seal and maybe a coupla hoses.

Cheers Gary

[Refugee]

Most amazing washer we had was a Zanusi that was 15 years old when it went due to leaks I couldn't be bothered to fix. In that time I bypassed the door interlock (don't need one), replaced the door seal and maybe a coupla hoses.

Cheers Gary

I have never bought a door interlock. A chop and a regular 15 amp microswitch is all that is needed. They get hotter than the boil wash heater and the plastic goes brittle with time. The first one I did had the door interlock replaced three times under one years warranty and was given to me as scrap. It was a Coulston washer/dryer.
These switches are a thermal timer and are not reliable at all and are more expensive than a motorised car door lock at main dealer prices.
It only needs to stop it filling with water with the door not shut correctly and that is it.