Making a bespoke wooden box.

[ucl82]

Wow Col, those lathes look beautiful. But like you say they take up a horrendous amount of space, we would be getting a metal lathe (the John Lang one on eBay would be ideal) if it was not for space. Such beautifully engineered tools and so useful but so cumbersome at the same time.

I love the sound of your old Denford (Viceroy?) Sharpedge, our school has one and we take all our chisels and plane irons in to sharpen on it and it's a wonderful bit of kit. Axminster do a similar style tool styled like a normal bench grinder complete with a wetstone low speed wheel and a honing guide (http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-axm...rc=froogle). There is a cheaper model but it doesn't include the honing guide tool.

[Retired]

Hi,

Now for something a bit different and something I’ve not attempted before although the technique is ancient. I wanted to fit a brass nameplate onto the box declaring its contents because these gears have a tendency of becoming separated from the winder rendering the winder useless. Lots of loose gear wheels mean very little to the average person but by housing them in a French polished wooden box they suddenly look important and hopefully will be treated as so. Please see;

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=boulle+work&hl=en&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=1p8BTsG3H8fKhAfl45i4DQ&ved=0CDMQsAQ&biw=1024&bih=677

I wanted to make the nameplate using hand tools at the least cost possible; I do own a very expensive top of the range variable speed Hegner Scrollsaw but decided to see if I was still capable of decent hand work so opted to use my old fashioned hand fret saw fitted with a piercing blade. Piercing saws are rather different to the common fretsaw the fret saw usually being regarded as a wood cutting saw used by modelers. Here is a genuine piercing saw;

http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/piercingsaw.html

The fret saw is more cumbersome to use than a proper piercing saw but has the advantage of a deeper throat; fitted with a piercing saw blade it does a good job.

I was surprised how long it took me to locate a suitable AVO logo but after surfing the web and finding lots of car parts I eventually found a suitable logo on my wave winder manual so scanned this and printed it out onto normal copy paper. I own two printers and both really need dumping in a skip as they are useless. My Samsung laser printer cost £80 years ago and right from the start whilst fitted with the correct toner cartridge it printed a very dark grey even with “Toner save” de-activated; when the cartridge ran out I was expected to pay £79.95 for a new genuine cartridge so opted for re-filling the original with powder bought from the Internet at a greatly reduced price.

My newish Epson all in one eats cartridges. The original cartridges soon ran out so once again I resorted to the Internet and bought equivalents only to find after installing a new cartridge and printing a test page the cartridge then read just over half full; this not only applies to equivalent cartridges because I surfed the web to find many owners of these printers have the same problem even whilst using genuine cartridge; this printer is now refusing to print demanding yet another yellow cartridge which it isn’t going to get and I now only use the scanner section so another lot of wasted money.

My plan was to use thick brass sheet as a backing plate and cut the logo and letters from thinner brass sheet using the fret saw then after fettling secure the letters and logo using powerful adhesive which Bron has kindly let me have; Bron uses Unibond Extreme Power Glue in her craft work and hopefully once I reach the stage it will prove ideal.

As an experiment I only printed copies of the AVO logo and secured a single copy to the thin sheet (15 thou) using double sided tape. I already had thick brass sheet in stock but was very surprised when I bought a piece of thin brass sheet measuring 7.5”x9” handing over £4. Before cutting the logo free from the larger sheet I drilled all the holes (pierced) for blade access to remove inner waste. The paper was helpful in preventing the drill bit from wandering.

       
AVO logo drilled and cut out.

I had already made a simple wooden sawing table from offcuts designing the table to be gripped in the woodworking vice; such tables are commonly called “pegs” but pegs are made slightly differently. I made the table extend from the vice far enough to prevent catching my hand on the vice whilst sawing. The table was made in minutes.

[attachment=2176][attachment=2177]
Sawing table and piercing saw blades.

With everything set up; the table in the vice; the piercing saw blade fitted and the chair pulled up to the vice I cut my very first piece of brass sheet using the fret saw; at first the blade wanted to bind at the start of the cut but I quickly found out a very gentle touch is needed and taking my time I cut the square from the sheet. I didn’t bother to lubricate the blade in fact I didn’t know lubrication was needed until later.

Now things quickly became interesting as the piece of brass was now considerably smaller and took some handling. I thought it best to remove the inner waste from the logo whilst the piece was at maximum size and slotted the blade through the first hole (Holes drilled at 1.5mm). Trying once again I had the logo the correct way up the second time now I had a major problem I couldn’t see what I was doing with my head at 45 degrees looking towards the sky in order to focus through my bi-focal glasses; I hate these glasses with a passion so in frustration dumped them on the bench; with a single strip light on the ceiling I was further hampered but I found that by putting my face close to the work I could now see what the blade was doing and found my rhythm with the saw; cutting gently using the full length of the blade taking great care to cut to the printing I was most impressed when I removed the saw to view my handiwork.

Piercing saw blades come in a range of different sized teeth and when I bought the Hegner I also bought a selection of piercing saw blades as I intended to have a go at Boulle Work at some point and these blades are cheap as can be seen in the picture. The blades are incredibly sharp and cut the thin brass sheet with ease.

I completed removing the inner waste from the logo then removed the outer waste which was more difficult as by now the piece of brass had become even smaller and much care was needed not to distort the thin sections as cutting proceeded. Cutting out the logo went much quicker than expected and although the logo needed fettling it looked excellent for a first attempt so next job was to tackle the letters.

Cutting the logo out required a lot of patience and care but I found the process most enjoyable and quickly mastered using the saw. It was difficult at first because I was all fingers and thumbs and at times found my hand and fingers ached due to holding the logo onto the table as the logo wanted to lift with the upward stroke of the saw. The saw table although adequate could be improved on it’s design; the hole could benefit from being made much smaller diameter and the cut out “V” needs to be much shallower for supporting small items being cut also the thickness of the table proved a problem it needs reducing below the “V”.

Spurred on by this success I selected suitable thick fonts and printed out the letters and attached these to the brass sheet again using double sided tape. Now the fun really began; the letters being much smaller than the logo proved at first to be extremely difficult to hold down onto the table; the inner waste of certain letters like “A” and “R” was now tiny so I used a 1mm drill bit and as before removed the inner waste first. Initial cutting of the outer letter profile was not too hard whilst the letter was still attached to the larger piece of brass but as cutting proceeded holding became increasingly difficult but once again with a little practice I soon got the hang of it; a thumb nail makes an excellent hold down; the letter “S” was a real challenge; I spent four hours cutting out 21 letters in the afternoon; in the evening I couldn’t settle so went into the workshop once again but now feeling refreshed and having had some practice cut out the remaining ten letters in 45 minutes. During all this cutting I only broke one blade when I inadvertently allowing the work to lift nipping the blade whilst applying too much enthusiasm.

       
Letters attached with double sided tape and cut out.

I hope this information isn’t too long winded but is exactly as I’ve done the job to date and there is yet plenty more to follow; at this point I don’t yet know if I will succeed in making the nameplate but I’m enjoying myself whilst trying. More to follow once I can resume work in the workshop.

Kind regards, Col.

[Yorkie]

at this point I don’t yet know if I will succeed in making the nameplate....

I do! Trust me on that

How do I know?

Very occasionally your projects may stall when other priorities come along, (like chimmney's threatening to collapse!) but they never fail.

Quote of the day:

"The difference between perseverance and obstinacy is that one comes from a strong will, and the other from a strong won't". ~Henry Ward Beecher

Anyone else would have had a Traffolite badge made for the box at Timpson's while they waited. Nah - way too easy!

I noticed at the piercing link you included, that on thin plate, it's often customary to cut it on the angle with a piercing saw. We tend to do that automatically when sawing flat sheet with a hacksaw, but it's a useful tip when using a piercing saw on thin plate to stop it chattering.

Thanks for an interesting post - looking forward to the next installment Colin!


David

[Retired]

Hi,

Many thanks for your kindness and encouragement David; it is much appreciated.

Also thanks for the tip about cutting thin metal with the saw used at an angle; this is very important as it is so easy to strip teeth from a blade. Using a hacksaw to cut directly across thin steel sheet will easily strip teeth from the blade and once this happens the result can be felt as the saw becomes uncontrollable as yet more teeth are stripped. I'm very careful in particular whilst using my large bandsaw as I don't use it to cut thin metal because blades cost around £38 each. Oil tempered hardboard is also aggressive on blades and actual sparks can be seen during cutting.

Whilst at our local post office yesterday morning I bought a tube of powerful super glue described as a glue ideal for sticking metal to metal.

Yesterday afternoon I successfully glued all the lettering into place; this took well over an hour of extremely fiddly work to accomplish but once the last letter was in place I felt very pleased with the job and could look forward to the finishing stages.

   
Letters attached with super glue.

I let the glue cure for five hours and last night decided to cut the nameplate from the large sheet of brass and set to with the fret saw. I clumsily dropped the sheet onto the workshop carpet and as I picked it up half the letters remained on the carpet. What a disaster and what a total waste of time it had been using the super glue; the remaining letters were easily slid off the sheet.

The instructions on the super glue tube stated that both surfaces must be clean and dry; this is brand new clean brass sheeting I'm using and I had taken the trouble to sand the gluing side of the letters.

The AVO brass logo though remained securely glued in place and I had used the glue (Unibond) Bron kindly gave me on this. Unfortunately this glue is uncontrollable as the tube is not supplied with a reducing nozzle; using this glue was like trying to glue miniature items with a fire hose as the glue merely oozed from the tube getting everywhere.

What appeared to be a most simple project has turned around and bitten me. To be let down by the super glue in this manner is totally frustrating.

This nameplate has now declared all out war on me so it's time for me to dig in and gather my weapons; I'm far from beaten yet!!

Kind regards, Col.

[Joe]

As I've said in another thread, cyanoacrylate is not to be trusted - I only use it when desperate or to temporarily hold something in place while I fix it with something better. It's also something where I've found there to be little difference between the cheap and expensive stuff.

As for Bron's glue, in cases like that I just put a blob on the bench and then apply it with a cocktail stick, bit of wire or whatever.

I don't doubt that you'll sort it eventually.

All the best
- Joe

[Retired]

Hi,

Many thanks for the extremely useful tip Joe. When I'm woodworking gluing joints I use your method but pour some adhesive into a lid and use a brush or old knife to apply it.

Gluing the letters onto the backplate takes takes me about an hour. I went the high tech route this afternoon and ground the Unibond tube cap to a point then drilled it at 1mm. This worked very well indeed as control of the glue was now under my control and by the time I had glued one letter into place just enough glue had been dispensed for the next letter and so on. This ensured the glue remained fresh for each letter and was just what I wanted. I used a pair of tweezers and a craft knife to position each letter ensuring the letter was pressed home. Once the last letter was glued a pin was inserted into the tube cap.

I hope this glue does the job and this time I scraped the gluing face of each letter and gave the backing plate a good sanding with 240 grit wet or dry paper.

I might have been unfair to the super glue because it had adhered strongly to the letters and I wonder if this is because I sanded them before gluing? I didn't sand the backing plate and although like you Joe I no longer trust super glue it might have proved successful had I also sanded the backing plate.

The Unibond glued the AVO logo to the backing plate without the plate being sanded.

If the letters are secured successfully this time then I plan to add a border around the plate but can foresee further problems with this as I need to carefully cut very narrow strips of thin brass sheet without buckling or distorting the strips; I'm much more confident now than I was last night.

The pictures show the tube cap roughly ground to a point and the nameplate now separated from the large brass sheet.

Kind regards, Col.

    [attachment=2214]

[Retired]

Hi,

I cut and added the borders last night. This morning I was keen to see if the glue had secured everything in place and it looked good. I then spent a neck aching hour removing surplus glue using a craft knife.

The nameplate was then taken into the garage and sanded using 240 grit abrasive paper with a small wood block backing. After dusting off; the nameplate was sprayed with Poundland gloss black auto acrylic; I omitted the undercoat in case it showed up as a fine grey line around all the edges once the final sanding had been completed. The black was flooded on and the nameplate left in the hot sun to allow the paint to dry; three such coats were applied then I washed the car and garage doors giving the paint time to set.

   
Sprayed black.

Once again I sanded with 240grit this time to highlight the AVO logo and lettering. The final job was to blow over with a coat of clear auto acrylic and allowing it to dry in the sun.

At last all my time and effort had paid off and I can now successfully make brass nameplates. I learned a great deal during this project and any further plates will be made of thicker gauge brass; epoxy adhesive could be used if the nameplates are for exterior use.

   
Completed nameplate.

I’ve added a picture of how I held the brass letters whilst they were being filed; an offcut of timber was mounted in the woodworking vice and worked very well resisting the push of the file whilst I pressed the letter against the wood using my thumb nail; the whole job was extremely fiddly as the letters are ¼” and 3/8” tall; a miniature vice would have been handy to have but both my vices are for heavy work.

   
Filing letters.

I knew what I wanted to achieve when I started this nameplate project and could see the finished plate in my head but the difficult part was how to achieve it. I’ve rested the nameplate on the box lid to take its picture but I’m undecided whether to glue the nameplate to the outer or inner face of the lid. If I glue it on the inside then it will be protected and make any future re-finishing of the lid a great deal easier.

After two years the wave winder is fully restored and the change gears stored neatly and safely in the new wooden box and hopefully by adding the nameplate this time the gears will not become separated and then lost. I love these unusual projects as I learn so much from scratch. I hope this has proved interesting.

Kind regards, Col.

[attachment=2262]

[ucl82]

Hi Col,
As always that's outstanding workmanship. Looks lovely

Josh.

[AlanBeckett]

Col,
When the old dog dies I'll know where to come for a box and a plate for the ashes
Alan

[Yorkie]

at this point I don’t yet know if I will succeed in making the nameplate....

I do! Trust me on that

How do I know?

Very occasionally your projects may stall when other priorities come along, (like chimmney's threatening to collapse!) but they never fail.

I rest my case!!

The nameplate and box set each other off nicely Colin.

“He that can have Patience, can have what he will”
(Benjamin Franklin)

David