Baird Phonovision

[tubesrule]

A friend just sent me this picture of Baird using an Edison-Bell Duplex machine (circa 1902-05) in what looks like an experimental phonovision. There is no information provided with the picture, but you can see from Baird's age and the various equipment, it looks to have been taken in the the mid to mid-late 1920's. There looks to be some sort of electronic pickup on top of the machine. Note that the whole screw mechanism for this pickup is fabricated, as on this machines the acoustic reproducer was underneath the drum.

Does anyone know anything about this picture?

Darryl

[ppppenguin]

This is certainly the first time I've seen Baird working with cylinder recordings rather than disc. Don McLean is the author of "Restoring Baird's Image" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Restoring-Histo...0852967950 AFAIK he only notes Baird working with disc, not cylinder.

Darryl, if you're not in touch with Don, I'll send you his email address.

PS: Just noted that although you've been registerd here for a few years this is your first post here on GVR. Welcome to the forum.

[tubesrule]

Jeff,
I had never seen this picture before or heard of Baird using cylinder machines. I'm trying to get more information on where this photo came from. It was given to me by a phonograph collector who saw it on a related forum.

I haven't corresponded with Don in quite a few years so I don't know if any contact info I have would be current. Does he frequent this forum?

Hmm, I thought I had posted previously but I guess not. Time is just rushing by.

[tubesrule]

A couple of other thoughts why he may have been using a cylinder machine;

These Concert machines would have been basically obsolete by this time and virtually worthless making them a low cost platform to experiment on.

These Concert machines, given the very large diameter had very high surface speed, and of course were linear across the entire surface which would have been desirable for his experiments.

Cylinders could be recorded, recut, and re-recorded making them inexpensive to experiment with.

Darryl

[tubesrule]

I just received the following from the original posting:


"This is from Restoring Baird's Image by Donald F. McLean, who was primarily responsible for obtaining the relatively clear Phonovision images linked above. The photograph seems to originally have been published in a book, Popular Television by Barton Chapple (1935). The caption by McLean is:

Baird with phonograph equipment. The original caption by Barton Chapple
refers to Baird 'carrying out his original Phonovision recording
experiments'. --From 'Popular Television', Barton Chapple, 1935

I would say the actual photo dates from before September, 1927, when Baird was using discs pressed by the Columbia Graphophone Company. This is under the presumption that Baird first experimented with cylinders before moving to discs. The only other reference to cylinder recording is another photo on the facing page showing Baird's apparatus for Noctovision, dated 1927, with a standard size cylinder sitting in front of a mechanism with a flywheel and standard size mandrel."


So Don certainly knows about these experiments. This was the first I had seen of cylinder machines used by Baird.

Daryl

[Doodlebug]

I made my 'Edikow' machine (EDIson/NIPkow) some years ago.
Baird used large dia concert cylinders whilat I tried with
standard dictaphone cylinders, recording two frames per rev.
Not very successfully I m ght add.

http://www.christerhamp.se/phono/noble.html
http://www.retinascope.co.uk/nbtv.html

[ppppenguin]

I guess my memory of Don's book was faulty. I've just looked through the book and didn't find the above picture. But that may be because I didn't look carefully enough. There are 2 cylinder pictures on pp236-7, one of which shows a 4" cyclinder with what is beleived to be a vision recording.

[peter scott]

Total madness! But I love it.

"There was no synchronisation  so the result is  a little top/bottom reversed"

I don't think the image is top/bottom reversed. Then again, maybe it is. It's a bit like one of those sad face /smiley face things.







Peter  

[tubesrule]

For some reason I can't find my copy of the book right now so I also can't verify the pictures. I don't doubt they are in there and that Baird did experiment with cylinder machines. I found this fascinating as I didn't remember ever reading about it, but if it is in Don's book, I guess I just didn't remember.

[ppppenguin]

Found the image in Don's book. p76. I can confirm the caption given above:

"Baird with phonograph equipment. The original caption by Barton Chapple refers to Baird 'carrying out his original Phonovision recording experiments'. --From 'Popular Television', Barton Chapple, 1935"

On p77 there's another photo with a cycliner phonograph:

"Detail from a photograph of Baird's apparatus at the British Association meeting in Leeds in 1927 showing Noctovision and cylinder Phonovision equipment. Courtesy of the Royal TV Society RTS 36-34."

Presumably from their archives.

Don's book is still available, but not cheap. You'll be lucky to get a copy under £40. One of his lectures is available online: https://vimeo.com/62777765
He gave this lecture, or a something very similar, several times. I saw it at the IEE in London and arranged for him to give it at a BVWS meeting in Harpenden. He's a very good speaker and his use of (presumably) Powerpoint is about the best I've ever seen.