Golborne Vintage Radio

Hello to all,
                I'll try and briefly share details of my car cassette project. It's a seventies car cassette player that wasn't working at all. Over time I found out the negative supply lead was out of circuit on the input side. I found that through by-passing that and feeding negative supply upstream, it powered up. However, after it turned out both drive belts had had it.

I finally got this player to play a cassette although it wasn't easy. I had to lock the cassette into place manually and cleaning the heads was very necessary as the whole machine was pretty dirty. I bought one proper drive belt and used an O ring for the other one (that wasn't the best idea).

The reason I'm posting is I've never been sure of the belt layout. At present the play setting works but on fast forward so far, tape can spiral out as the take-up reel isn't doing its job at this time.

Is there any way to know if I have these belts correctly fitted? Unfortunately the workshop manual is a bit vague and shows no complete diagram of the belt and its pulleys.

Good news is I ordered more belts and am glad it does now actually play. The mechanism is still not functioning that well but I hope to sort it all out in time.

That's a puzzler

I spent my childhood taking apart 1970s stuff - in the name of science, you understand! - and I'm sure that my guilty conscience is what got me into the restoration/collecting scene...

What would help - if possible - would be a picture of the top of the deck. As it is, I can't quite visualise where the cassette is, and what exactly does what...

Perhaps an obvious thing to say, but when in FF, the pinch roller should be lifted from the capstan, and the spool is the only thing that is driven. So it shouldn't be possible for the capstan/pinch roller to throw a loop. Perhaps this deck is an exception to that rule? Yes, simply speeding up the motor in FF (and muting the audio) is feasible, but I can't think of many instances where that is done. I've seen a couple where the speed control is bypassed to get a bit more RPM from the motor, but this is normally in conjunction with a gearing/pulley change to provide the bulk of the speed increase. Does this make sense?

Another possibility is perhaps the spool is being turned the wrong way in FF. Often, a different idler is used (different compared to PB). Don't ask me why, but I can't help feeling suspicious of the belt path (the long one). It's obviously OK at the top-right, where it goes around the flywheel, out to the white pulley and back to the motor. But as it goes around the black pulley, I wonder if it should go the other side, so that the pulley turns in the opposite direction to the flywheel?

Cheers,

Mark

Someone else commented on the black wheel belt path. It could well be the way it is now is incorrect. Today I printed out more pages from the service manual and I'll search for clues. Also, I am just in the process of maybe buying another Pye car cassette player with a view to using that as a blueprint. Pity the manual isn't more detailed as to the belt but maybe I can find clues.

I'll try and forward more detail of the player for you and hopefully in time it will be right.

I ordered a bunch of 10 belts so if the belt is wrong the way it is, I'll have others to experiment with.

The roller under the black pulley looks like the fast forward idler. Also I agree about the belt going the other side of the black pulley. There should be a take up clutch in the shaft for the black pulley.

It was very easy to swap the belt the other side of that pulley but I don't make a test till my new belts come. I need to get it fast forwarding now so both reels pull the tape correctly. Play was working although I had to tap the head a bit till it started to read the tape. The head mechanism seems to release on spring pressure but maybe a worn spring and also lack of lubrication has stopped this happening so I have to carefully use my finger and ease the heads back.

I was really pretty clueless as cassette players are new to me. However, when I was a kid, I always gravitated somehow towards cassette tapes and grew up with the cassette tape so that sort of re-kindled my interest.

Any recommendations as to the best oil to use? This player was really very dirty and must have been removed from a car after the belts broke and then left a few years.

When I was a kid, I also had a fascination with cassette decks. I used to really enjoy figuring out how all the various modes worked, and I marvelled at the brains that designed the units. The auto-reverse car mechanisms were especially interesting. I built an old Radiomobile mechanism into a plywood box, and built my own amplification for it, and for a couple of years that was my shed music system. Happy days indeed

The best advice I can offer is to try and do the same exploration. It might not be immediately obvious, but after a while, I'm sure you'll be able to figure out how the basic PB, FF and RW modes work. Along the way, you might discover a worn rubber idler, a broken or weak spring, or a bent part of the mechanism. While potentially very time-consuming, just remember that this is all part of the enjoyment of the hobby!

Having said that, I guess it depends on personality. I love the opportunity to take time "bonding" with whatever is currently on my bench - even if the original fault was fixed in 5 minutes, I'll still spend an age playing and investigating (which sometimes pays off, as other, more subtle problems can be discovered along the way). But, because that's the sort of person I am (a "reflector", apparently!), I'd never make a living doing repairs. But I'd be happy in my work

Regarding lubrication, the watchword is "sparingly"!

When grease dries up, it can cause all sorts of problems. So I start by removing all traces of the original, and apply a very small amount of new grease. I can't remember what my stuff is, but IIRC it came from RS, and is sold as suitable for this sort of work. I'm sure someone else can suggest something...

You won't need much oil. The capstan is the main element, but these usually have phosphor-bronze bearings that are mostly self-lubricating. A light touch of sewing-machine oil is the usual recommendation.

Many other moving parts are designed to run dry. Often, it's a judgement call as to which are which.

Needless to say, avoid rubber parts and the felt pads in the clutches.

Don't forget to clean the capstan so that all traces of oxide are gone. Likewise the pinch roller (worn or dirty pinch rollers are responsible for a lot of problems). I remove it from the machine and clean it with a lint-free cloth laid flat on the bench, having first applied IPA or similar to the cloth. Keep going until the pinch roller is matt black - it might take a while...

Doing the above requires a lot of dismantling., but today, we do at least have the advantage of digital cameras. Make sure the circlips don't ping off and become lost forever

I hope this "general" advice is of interest, and do please feel free to come back with specific questions (pictures really help!). Either way, keep us updated.

Good luck,

Mark

I have a Radio-mobile to try and fix later. It's totally dead and has some rust on the chassis inside.

With regard to what you say about working methodically and slowly, I think I'm more theoretical by nature than practical at repairs. I very much enjoy reading the theory and doing related maths. I have this big 1960 book on HAM radio (American) and it's pretty deep. Finally I realised I needed to do some actual repair work so forced myself to try and work on broken and faulty radios. Now I've also found an interest in tape players as well.

Anyway I got a pack of assorted drive belts today and so the 8 Track Player I have now works fine. The tape itself was faulty as the foam pressure pads had crumbled so I found the correct way to insert new pads. Opening the 8 track tape, though, was hard doing and you don't really need to open them at all (but I did). People tell me 8 tracks are simpler to work on as less complicated than cassette.

I'll follow your tips with regard to the Pye Cassette. I have ordered another one from a seller on E-Bay that was going for a mere £2.50 as untested. I noticed the item was being relisted over and over again and no bids so I put a bid on it and that was that. Nobody else bothered but I'll now be more than happy to try and get both of the Pye Car Cassette Players up and running if possible.

I'll resume work on the Pye Player maybe this weekend. I'll keep you all updated.

Again thanks for the advice and it seems like I found the right website to get tips from experienced engineers. Many thanks.

That sounds like progress

Nothing beats the satisfaction of resurrecting something that was basically scrap in the eyes of most people. And cassette is still a useful medium today. The difficulty is getting all the machines lined up so the cassettes are compatible with each machine - especially azimuth. But worth the effort...

Looking forward to the next progress report

The other Pye Cassette player arrived today. I was a bit short of time but popped it open. It would seem the little DC motor is dead. There is also the main supply socket missing which means a fair bit of circuit tracing. I've never yet encountered a dead motor and found little information online but my guess is I'll have to either find another motor or try and fix the existing one if possible. Otherwise the player seems to be in great condition internally so it probably just needs a new motor.

Now I have a few comments to make:

I just learned about tyres on idler pulleys. You see I tested my first Pye player again with the belt fitted the new way and eventually I got it to play. It also fast forwarded. I then noticed a patch of half-moon rubber. On closer inspection I found a fault with the pulley that's the other side of the cassette spool. It has a tyre round the rim and this had split. To the touch it was sticky. With a stroke of genius, I decided to remove both halves of the tyre and use superglue to stick them together and back onto the pulley. This meant removing the spool via three tiny screws. Later I concluded my stroke of genius was maybe just a bad idea. It seems the tyre is worn and definitely dragging the motor as it doesn't spin freely when it should. So, now I'm thinking maybe my best bet is to do a better job and maybe even consider replacing with an O ring as a new tyre. However, I'm, not sure how important that tyre is except it is catching due to the joint part of the circumference.

Next the transistor. I suspect it's faulty. Part of the engage mechanism isn't working and so I suspect the transistor. I tested it with a DMM and the results are something to ponder. One of the PN junctions seems to be reading a resistance both ways. The other junction is only reading one way as it should. However, I'm not exactly sure which is emitter or collector or base as space is very limited to pinpoint. Still the readings suggest it may be worth fitting a new transistor.

I feel like I have a job on my hands here. I don't think I can stop till it starts to sound as it should but it's one pretty neglected cassette player.

Any thoughts welcome.

Here hopefully is a pic showing the pulley and its worn tyre. This has been glued back on but I'm not sure that was the best way to go about it.